here are some articles emminent economists and journalists some of which are nobel laureates and some by credible institutes like the cato institute:
Larry Elder:
http://www.capmag.com/article.asp?ID=2051
Thomas Sowell:
http://www.townhall.com/opinion/columns ... 70348.html
Cato institute articles:http://www.cato.org/pubs/pas/pa106.html
http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=5409
http://www.cato.org/dailys/10-28-99.html
Milton friedman quotes (nobel laureate)
"The high rate of unemployment among teenagers, and especially black teenagers, is both a scandal and a serious source of social unrest. Yet it is largely a result of minimum wage laws. We regard the minimum wage law as one of the most, if not the most, anti-black laws on the statute books. "
Milton Friedman, Nobel Prize-winning economist
"Selfishness is not myopic selfishness. It is whatever it is that interests the participants, whatever they value, whatever goals they pursue. The scientist seeking to advance the frontiers of his discipline, the philantrophist seeking to bring comfort to the needy, the missionary seeking to convert infidels to the true faith - all are pursuing their interests, as they see them, as they judge them by their own values. "
"Currently more than 40% of our income is disposed of on our behalf by government at federal, state and local levels combined. One of us suggested a new national holiday, "Personal Independence Day" - that day in the year when we stop working to pay for the expenses of the government, and start working to pay for the items we severally and individually choose in light of our own needs and desires. In 1929, that holiday would have come on Feb 12; today it would come about May 30; if present trends were to continuel it would coincide with July 4. " (p.56 [from Newsweek])
mises institute
http://www.mises.org/story/2130
Gary Becker (nobel laureate, university of chicago) explains the cause of french riots due to generous minimum wage laws:
http://www.becker-posner-blog.com/archi ... rance.html
John stossel journalist (20/20) and libertarian:
"The truth is that people on the margins lose jobs when minimum wages go up. We used to have people washing windshields at gas stations. We don't anymore because of the minimum wage. There's no opportunity for kids, for entry-level workers."
the most distinguished economic school in the country, the Unversity of Chicago's prevasive thought is that the minimum wage is to be abolished. This is the most empircally statistical rigourous school in economics in the world.
Minimum wage articles by economists
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kenshikenji
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Minimum wage articles by economists
Last edited by kenshikenji on Wed Jun 07, 2006 11:32 am, edited 5 times in total.
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Cloud
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How long ago was that?
The Three Laws of Robotics:
1. A robot may not injure a human being, or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.
2. A robot must obey the orders given it by human beings except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.
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kenshikenji
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Why now? Thank you for your request. Where is discuss this on an economy board somewhere?
The Three Laws of Robotics:
1. A robot may not injure a human being, or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.
2. A robot must obey the orders given it by human beings except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.
3. A robot must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Law.
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kenshikenji
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ill stop here, but i did think this was an anything forum. i wont respond to any more economic threads. its just a little sad that there cant be more rational discourse, because people feel that opinions are not subject to it, whether it be religion or politics. sorry didnt mean to offend anyone, as you can tell i believe strongly about freedom.Pudge wrote:Thanks so much for posting those. Now please go discuss
this on an economy board somewhere.
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RahOtaku
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kenshikenji!
You are sooo Right!
Killing the Minimum wage will solve all our problems!
Think of it!
1. We can now be able to compete with Third world countries, since all the "kids" (stossel) and "blacks" such as Milton said will decide that they will work for $200-300 per month.
2. Great! So as soon as all the "kids" and "blacks" start working for pennies instead of dollars per hour. We will no longer have to pay as high for rent since no one can afford to pay rent on $200-$300 per month!
3. It'll be great for Real Estate! Property Values will Soar! As rent prices drop!
4. Instead of stealing and Selling illegal substances, people will have jobs that pay nothing and therefore be happy making half the income they used to make!
I can think up like 50 more reasons why killing the minimum wage is like awesome!
By lowering how much the "kids" and "african-americans" get paid, They'll have more incentive to Go WORK instead of something illegal!
Those economists you are talking about are saying that just because they are black/Homelesse/etc, then they won't get hired.
It's convenient to blame your Race and Homelessness, since it can't be changed very easily.
Michael Jackson has almost successfully become White. And I know some Homeless people who have started anew.
In the end, They are wrong. It is their Work Ethic and Culture that tells them that working is a dead end road and that being on welfare and selling drugs/weapons is how to make it big. If you don't understand that, then having your vast amount of knowledge is complete waste.
Change the SubCulture where your Rap Songs, Grand Theft Auto, and Stop those people from giving the Homeless people 10 dollar bills.
And you've solved the problem.
What you've proposed is workable for economists who are naive about the world.
In no way am I insulting you, I only think you're too naive about how black culture and homeless culture works.
You are sooo Right!
Killing the Minimum wage will solve all our problems!
Think of it!
1. We can now be able to compete with Third world countries, since all the "kids" (stossel) and "blacks" such as Milton said will decide that they will work for $200-300 per month.
2. Great! So as soon as all the "kids" and "blacks" start working for pennies instead of dollars per hour. We will no longer have to pay as high for rent since no one can afford to pay rent on $200-$300 per month!
3. It'll be great for Real Estate! Property Values will Soar! As rent prices drop!
4. Instead of stealing and Selling illegal substances, people will have jobs that pay nothing and therefore be happy making half the income they used to make!
I can think up like 50 more reasons why killing the minimum wage is like awesome!
By lowering how much the "kids" and "african-americans" get paid, They'll have more incentive to Go WORK instead of something illegal!
Those economists you are talking about are saying that just because they are black/Homelesse/etc, then they won't get hired.
It's convenient to blame your Race and Homelessness, since it can't be changed very easily.
Michael Jackson has almost successfully become White. And I know some Homeless people who have started anew.
In the end, They are wrong. It is their Work Ethic and Culture that tells them that working is a dead end road and that being on welfare and selling drugs/weapons is how to make it big. If you don't understand that, then having your vast amount of knowledge is complete waste.
Change the SubCulture where your Rap Songs, Grand Theft Auto, and Stop those people from giving the Homeless people 10 dollar bills.
And you've solved the problem.
What you've proposed is workable for economists who are naive about the world.
In no way am I insulting you, I only think you're too naive about how black culture and homeless culture works.
Last edited by RahOtaku on Wed Jun 07, 2006 3:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Ahhh... How cute!!! 
Magical Kitty Transformation!
Magical Kitty Transformation!
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I have gotten this kinda feeling.
The Three Laws of Robotics:
1. A robot may not injure a human being, or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.
2. A robot must obey the orders given it by human beings except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.
3. A robot must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Law.
-I, Robot (Asimov)
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wELCOME cONSUMER
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I think [quote]
Oh his or her goodness you that is a lot of things.
Oh his or her goodness you that is a lot of things.
The Three Laws of Robotics:
1. A robot may not injure a human being, or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.
2. A robot must obey the orders given it by human beings except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.
3. A robot must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Law.
-I, Robot (Asimov)
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Lynxa
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While I didn't read those articles (my attention span is far too short 
) I DID just finish doing a lengthy paper on the state of France's economy and some of the issues so....*ahem*.... poignantly pointed out by RahOtaku did come up.
Again, I didn't read the articles, but what I'm guessing they said was that higher minimum wages often price people who are in "less demand" out of the market. Those people in lower demand (for a host of reasons: inexperience, lower skills, or race) are just as employable at lower pay rates as people who are in high demand are at higher pay rates.
An argument has been made that high minimum wage protects higher paid workers from the competition of lower-paid workers. High minimum wage coupled with other government benefits could be seen as stratifying the society.
While I don't agree with all of that argument, and there are DEFINITELY concerns about exploiting people with lower minimum wage (I don't think the Great Market can overcome all) there are also instances where a high minimum wage can be just as exploitative as a low one. *shrug*
Edit: found the article I got most of this from: http://www.capmag.com/article.asp?ID=4472
) I DID just finish doing a lengthy paper on the state of France's economy and some of the issues so....*ahem*.... poignantly pointed out by RahOtaku did come up.Again, I didn't read the articles, but what I'm guessing they said was that higher minimum wages often price people who are in "less demand" out of the market. Those people in lower demand (for a host of reasons: inexperience, lower skills, or race) are just as employable at lower pay rates as people who are in high demand are at higher pay rates.
An argument has been made that high minimum wage protects higher paid workers from the competition of lower-paid workers. High minimum wage coupled with other government benefits could be seen as stratifying the society.
While I don't agree with all of that argument, and there are DEFINITELY concerns about exploiting people with lower minimum wage (I don't think the Great Market can overcome all) there are also instances where a high minimum wage can be just as exploitative as a low one. *shrug*
Edit: found the article I got most of this from: http://www.capmag.com/article.asp?ID=4472
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RahOtaku
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A higher minimum wage forces up the productivity of a nation as a whole.
I know how horrible that sounds....
In order for you to have a job you have to have a higher work ethic.
Thus the Hard working Illegal mexican/African-american makes $10-15 an hour while the Lazy mexican/African-american stands in line for welfare.
I know how horrible that sounds....
In order for you to have a job you have to have a higher work ethic.
Thus the Hard working Illegal mexican/African-american makes $10-15 an hour while the Lazy mexican/African-american stands in line for welfare.
Ahhh... How cute!!!
Magical Kitty Transformation!
Magical Kitty Transformation!
Since soda's apparently not around, let me be the first to take odds that this tread has maybe 1 or 2 more responses before lockdown.
Seriously, were this a debate over, say, Keynesian vs. laissez-faire capitalism economic strategies as applied to current world affairs and how they directly affect whether the Fed will keep increasing interest rates in order to counter rising inflation that is keeping me from being able to secure any kind of savings in order to invest in certain futures (ie. - cels) then I might see this as a viable thread.
As it stands, the current discussion is too broad which does nothing but serve to aggravate all of our already short fuses on said subject and will generate only circular arguements on both sides which always end with harsh words.
So unnecessary....
Seriously, were this a debate over, say, Keynesian vs. laissez-faire capitalism economic strategies as applied to current world affairs and how they directly affect whether the Fed will keep increasing interest rates in order to counter rising inflation that is keeping me from being able to secure any kind of savings in order to invest in certain futures (ie. - cels) then I might see this as a viable thread.
As it stands, the current discussion is too broad which does nothing but serve to aggravate all of our already short fuses on said subject and will generate only circular arguements on both sides which always end with harsh words.
So unnecessary....
