Fake Tezuka Osamu & Rumiko Takahashi Shikishi?

Auctions on Yahoo Japan
Post Reply
User avatar
Promethium
Eiyuu - Hero
Posts: 161
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2011 6:34 pm
Location: LaMetale
Contact:

Fake Tezuka Osamu & Rumiko Takahashi Shikishi?

Post by Promethium »

Don't think anyone from this side of the pond is bidding on them...?

This seller's (YJ ID: cocoets) Tetsuya Chiba & Nobuyuki Fukumoto Shikishi looks legit (well, at least to me) But his Rumiko Takahashi & Tezuka Osamu shikishi look like outright sloppy fakes to me. They're getting bids so I'm wondering if there's something I'm not aware of? :shrug Thoughts?

Osamu Tezuka Shikishi
http://page6.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/f104826212

Rumiko Takahashi Shikishi
http://page13.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/r84149962

Nobuyuki Fukumoto Shikishi
http://page7.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/g109165735

Tetsuya Chiba Shikishi
http://page13.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/r84149084
http://page18.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/w68899336
iceman57
Senpai - Elder
Posts: 1028
Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2009 10:08 am
Location: Paris, France
Contact:

Re: Fake Tezuka Osamu & Rumiko Takahashi Shikishi?

Post by iceman57 »

Simply boycott Yahoo Japan :badass
THE ART OF ANIME Cultural Exhibition
HD video trailer: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QS51tjKlhB0
Facebook fan page: http://www.facebook.com/theartofanime
User avatar
D123
Kishin - Fierce God
Posts: 588
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2007 11:00 pm
Location: N.J
Contact:

Re: Fake Tezuka Osamu & Rumiko Takahashi Shikishi?

Post by D123 »

I know there is a BIG problem with fake shikishi on YJ, many bid on them for crazy prices getting duped be VERY careful I would never trust buying them off of YJ :roll:
User avatar
cutiebunny
Yosutebito - Hermit
Posts: 1936
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2005 1:55 pm
Location: Rockin' da Cats-bah
Contact:

Re: Fake Tezuka Osamu & Rumiko Takahashi Shikishi?

Post by cutiebunny »

Yeah, they're fake. When it comes to YJ, stay away from big, well known names. There are a couple of reasons as to why they might have bids. The first is that they're using another ID to bid on their own items and the second is that Japanese people can be very trusting, and they may think that it's legitimate. When it comes to the Takahashis and Osamus of the anime world, buy them on Mandarake. You will pay a hefty premium for them on Mandarake, but they'll be legit.

When I bid on shikishi on YJ, I tend to look at a lot of things like how old the seller's YJ account is and where the majority of their glowing feedback came from. If it's a recent account and the majority of the feedback came from buying items, then, that's a big red flag there. Needless to say, I don't buy much in the way of shikishi from YJ...
User avatar
D123
Kishin - Fierce God
Posts: 588
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2007 11:00 pm
Location: N.J
Contact:

Re: Fake Tezuka Osamu & Rumiko Takahashi Shikishi?

Post by D123 »

cutiebunny wrote:Yeah, they're fake. When it comes to YJ, stay away from big, well known names. There are a couple of reasons as to why they might have bids. The first is that they're using another ID to bid on their own items and the second is that Japanese people can be very trusting, and they may think that it's legitimate. When it comes to the Takahashis and Osamus of the anime world, buy them on Mandarake. You will pay a hefty premium for them on Mandarake, but they'll be legit.

When I bid on shikishi on YJ, I tend to look at a lot of things like how old the seller's YJ account is and where the majority of their glowing feedback came from. If it's a recent account and the majority of the feedback came from buying items, then, that's a big red flag there. Needless to say, I don't buy much in the way of shikishi from YJ...
Ditto
User avatar
Promethium
Eiyuu - Hero
Posts: 161
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2011 6:34 pm
Location: LaMetale
Contact:

Re: Fake Tezuka Osamu & Rumiko Takahashi Shikishi?

Post by Promethium »

I'm not a shikishi collector but I love to browse original artworks. 8)
I'm pretty good at spotting fakes, but this time they looked like BLATANT fakes and they were getting bids /?: /?: /?: so it threw me off. The Tezuka got a 17000 yen winning bid and Takahashi got a 16500 yen winning bid. X|

As per Mandarake, I wouldn't trust them 100% as per authenticity tho. If Mandarake were absolutely certain that they're authentic, they would issue a "certificate of authenticity" every time, which they don't - only on some. In general, they're on the mark but I've seen mislistings, too. They've also gotten in trouble in the past for selling pretty high profile stolen items (meaning they don't really check their stuff), so I wouldn't trust their 'eye' a 100%. I do agree they're more reliable in terms of authenticity than YJ tho :^^:
User avatar
cutiebunny
Yosutebito - Hermit
Posts: 1936
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2005 1:55 pm
Location: Rockin' da Cats-bah
Contact:

Re: Fake Tezuka Osamu & Rumiko Takahashi Shikishi?

Post by cutiebunny »

The majority of items that Mandarake sells do not have a certificate of authenticity. I'd say close to 95% of all items (including cels, sketches, toys, original artwork) do not come with this certificate. If anything, the certificate is more of a guarantee that the item is worth the initial starting price, and not what you ended up paying for it. Most of the time, these certificates are generally reserved for the BWA items, and not the Everyday auctions or Dollar bin items you can find at their stores.

The reason why many collectors will pay several times the amount that the same item would sell for on YJ is that they put it in writing that they do not sell fakes. That's important if you're willing to invest several thousand into a Ghibli set-up or an original Tezuka item - it means that if you are sold a fake and they refuse to return your money, you can take them to court. Granted, I'm not familiar with Japanese law, but I'd imagine that they have consumer protections in place in the event of fraud. YJ has no such protection, so it's caveat emptor.

Has Mandarake sold stolen goods? Yes. But I'd imagine that other sellers and companies have as well, the only difference being that Mandarake is a high profile retailer where as seller_xyz on YJ isn't (and therefore might be able to get away with it easier). A lot of artwork either originated by studio personnel taking home items or because someone decided it would be profitable to dive through a studio's dumpster. And who knows how many sales have occured due to lover's quarrels, liquidation of deceased collectors or are forcefully taken to pay off a debt? I'm guilty of buying items from these 'sales', and chances are, either wittingly or unwittingly, I'll do it again.
User avatar
Promethium
Eiyuu - Hero
Posts: 161
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2011 6:34 pm
Location: LaMetale
Contact:

Re: Fake Tezuka Osamu & Rumiko Takahashi Shikishi?

Post by Promethium »

cutiebunny wrote:The majority of items that Mandarake sells do not have a certificate of authenticity. I'd say close to 95% of all items (including cels, sketches, toys, original artwork) do not come with this certificate. If anything, the certificate is more of a guarantee that the item is worth the initial starting price, and not what you ended up paying for it. Most of the time, these certificates are generally reserved for the BWA items, and not the Everyday auctions or Dollar bin items you can find at their stores.
Actually, Mandarake issues certificate of authenticity only for cels and genga art and they have guidelines as per issuing them. A) if the item's original listing price starts at 10000 yen or above B) When the exhibitor requests it (whatever that means....but I'm sure they need to prove its authenticity to Mandarake for them to issue one)

A lot of BWA items start higher than 10000 yen, so hence the higher number of items with certificates. They issue them for Everyday Auctions too as long as its original listing price is 10000 yen or higher, or if the exhibitor requests it. :)

All this info is available on this page.
http://www.mandarake.co.jp/auction/faq_ja/warranty.html
cutiebunny wrote:The reason why many collectors will pay several times the amount that the same item would sell for on YJ is that they put it in writing that they do not sell fakes.
That's not what Mandarake says in the Japanese version of the website tho. I've never read the English site's text so I didn't realize they wrote "There is no risk of fake items." Here's what they say on the JP site, "Concerning the Auctions, Mandarake turns down obvious fakes, but Mandarake takes absolutely no responsibility with items without a Certificate of Authenticity, so please bid on your own accord."

このオークション大会に出展の商品に関しては明らかに贋作はお断りしていますが、保証書のない品に関しては、まんだらけは一切責任を負いませんので皆様の責任においてご入札ください。

If they had 2 auctions, one for the Japanese market and one for the international market with completely separate items, this would make sense for the contradicting warranty but since there's only one auction for all the markets, the English warranty is probably just a poor translation of the original Japanese. They're a Japanese company so I'm going with the warrantee explaination written in their native language. I'm not saying Mandarake sells fakes - just that I wouldn't put my faith in Mandarake 100% as per authenticity (even if they say "no risk of fakes" in the Eng text), as no appraiser is perfect - to Mandarake's own admission. :wink:
Post Reply