How is production art made available to dealers/collectors?

Cenbe · Post by **Cenbe** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 3:28 pm

One thing I've been very curious about as a new collector is how artwork finds it's way out of a production studio into the hands of dealers and collectors. I can imagine this varies a lot with different shows/studios. I've even seen reference somewhere to it being borderline illegal, or at least strictly against studio policy. Maybe because of copyright/intellectual property issues or something?

Then I read in Hoodies & Raindrops gallery (wow, Lain art to drool over for a lifetime!) about Haibane Renmei art being destroyed by contractual agreement. What a shame! But it's hard to believe that with thousands of pieces of art, something didn't get snuck out somehow on the way to the incinerator or whatever. Does anyone know any other shows in similar situations?

I'm sure there has to be something written about this subject somewhere, so if anyone can point me to a link or has some knowledge about it, I'd appreciate it very much.

(I'm sorry if this has been discussed elsewhere at length, but I can't seem to find anything in past posts.)

RoboFlonne · Post by **RoboFlonne** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 5:47 pm

The animators probably sneak some out during lunch time... in a large bento box!

EternityOfPain · Post by **EternityOfPain** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 6:10 pm

Well, the reason that art in the past was destroyed was because cels/sketches were really the "waste" of the company. After they used it for the production of the anime it was no other than garbage. So what would occur is that they would burn/get rid of it to clear space. Then of course they realized that individuals actually like they garbage so sometimes you see private deals between dealers and the studio to buy large volume sketches or cels (it wasn't abnormal for dealers to lay down 20,30,50 (thosuands of dollars) to purchase huge volumes of sketches / cels of a given series (that is why you will notice that some dealers seem to have certain series while some dont, its all about location and if you are able to track down the one that has the goods you want). Now there are the other case where through an agreement (that you mentioned) that a studio is not able to part with any artwork from (the little you see of some series means they were stolen / smuggled out). Because copyright laws there are different, just because you create the series does not always mean you own the right to the characters drawn. Hopefully this answered some of your questions

As far as other shows there are many. If you notice there isn't much artwork out there (visable to you) chances are most was burned/ bought by what we call "blackhole collectors" (basically, people who collect a series but dont post there cels/sketches online) which may make a series appear to have little artwork but in reality the story is different.

ReiTheJelly · Post by **ReiTheJelly** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 8:30 pm

Animation production materials have an odd history.

For the older shows, any number of things could have happened:
(1) Studio sells a portion of their cels for $$$$$$ to a known dealer
(2) Studio wipes the cels clean and reuses the acetate for a new show
(3) Studio employees steal the pieces they like best, and later sell them
(4) Studio either purposefully or accidentally destroyed all materials
(5) Studio can sell/auction the cels on their own, or consign them to a dealer.

For newer shows, some situations are the same, but with cels being replaced completely by sketches, new issues arise:
(1) Studio can sell the "quality" sketches to a dealer and destroy the rest
(2) Studio doesn't want the art on the market, so destroys all ephemera
(3) Studio employees still steal.

(4) Studio keeps certain sketches, which are then used to make Relizu cels and sold for a higher price than the sketches alone would be worth
(5) While it seems to be happening less, some studios still seem to slowly leak their sketches onto auction sites like Y!J or various dealer sites.

In some cases (especially with older shows), the studio didn't properly store the materials after they were created, so they were inadvertently destroyed. Some studios (no Japanese ones that I know of), had warehouse fires that destroyed a good portion of the cels and sketches.

Dealers who obtain cels and sketches directly from the studios usually have a shell out A LOT of money up front. That's how Anime Link ended up with most of the Vampire Hunter D: Bloodlust cels.

Other dealers (mostly Japanese) have contacts inside the studio that are willing to smuggle pieces out. The Japanese animation industry is very mindful of this, which is why you see very few Japanese people with online cel galleries - they could get busted for showcasing stolen materials.

The story in short: dealers have good contacts within the industry.

Cenbe · Post by **Cenbe** » Fri Oct 12, 2007 5:42 pm

Wow! Thanks a lot for the great info EoP and Rei. Makes me appreciate even more the stuff that somehow manages to filter down into my own collection.

Cloud · Post by **Cloud** » Fri Oct 12, 2007 5:43 pm

You are quite welcome! How about that.

kizu · Post by **kizu** » Sat Oct 13, 2007 10:57 am

I hear that cels were also given out to the production staff, mostly as a "gift" because they were not paid well in the old days. So not all of them were stolen.

Then there are cels that was given out as part of promotions and souveneirs, unsure though of that one.

Cloud · Post by **Cloud** » Sat Oct 13, 2007 10:57 am

Ahem. But some of them are?

kizu · Post by **kizu** » Sat Oct 13, 2007 10:58 am

Cloud wrote:Ahem. But some of them are?

Yes Cloud some of them are.

Cloud · Post by **Cloud** » Sat Oct 13, 2007 10:58 am

Umm. Good example.

kizu · Post by **kizu** » Sat Oct 13, 2007 10:59 am

Cloud wrote:Umm. Good example.

Isn't it?

You're awfully talkative to me today.

Moop · Post by **Moop** » Sat Oct 13, 2007 11:27 am

I know that a massive quantity of YYH cels were originally released to be sold cheap by the Animate chain store, which doesn't even have the distinction of being a cel dealer. Some of the best cels from the series ended up thumbtacked to fans' bedroom walls until they faded into oblivion.

I suppose that it's probably not the only series which was released to the public en masse.