Isnt this a fan cel? DBZ

hyelakingsfan · Post by **hyelakingsfan** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 10:10 pm

http://cgi.ebay.com/Dragonball-Z-Super- ... dZViewItem

minigt · Post by **minigt** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 10:12 pm

I tend to agree. I would say fan cel.

wELCOME cONSUMER · Post by **wELCOME cONSUMER** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 10:18 pm

Really? Why? I know nothing about DBZ and am curious to learn.

There's no brown lines, which looks kind of suspicious. All of the DBZ cels I've ever seen have some kind of line fade (from minimal to significant).

hyelakingsfan · Post by **hyelakingsfan** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 10:49 pm

Its the colors that are throwing me off.

wELCOME cONSUMER · Post by **wELCOME cONSUMER** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 10:52 pm

Oh. Do you have a screencap or anything to compare it to? Or maybe a sequence mate.

*is learning*

DragonballZSubzero · Post by **DragonballZSubzero** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 11:13 pm

Yeah, I saw that early today too and thought the same thing.

I agree that the colors are all wrong. Normally the skin tones have more pink in them, it gives it more of a peach color than a tan color like that one has.

Also, the color of the shadows in his hair is all messed up, those are definitely not the colors used to make his hair.

But hey, maybe this was just one really werid part of an episode that called for those colors, and maybe all the lines stayed perfectly black and didn't fade.... or maybe this person is just trying to rip someone off.

Sugarflower · Post by **Sugarflower** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 12:44 pm

Well, when clicking back and forth the pictures of the sketch and cel I noticed
that some of the paint on the cel over extends the lines of the sketch, mainly
around the painted shadows. I hope that didn't sound confusing, lol.

Try it
and see.

wELCOME cONSUMER · Post by **wELCOME cONSUMER** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:17 pm

Maybe he should relist it as a fancel and see who's interested. It might actually sell then

DragonballZSubzero · Post by **DragonballZSubzero** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 2:53 pm

wELCOME cONSUMER wrote:Maybe he should relist it as a fancel and see who's interested. It might actually sell then

Yeah that probably would be better. Of course he might want to first lower his price from $400...

wELCOME cONSUMER · Post by **wELCOME cONSUMER** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 4:45 pm

DragonballZSubzero wrote:
wELCOME cONSUMER wrote:Maybe he should relist it as a fancel and see who's interested. It might actually sell then
Yeah that probably would be better. Of course he might want to first lower his price from $400...

No kidding

akadro · Post by **akadro** » Fri Dec 15, 2006 1:06 am

I think that the sketch is real but the cel is a fan cel, he or someone else made the cel from the sketch, this is only a guess but the sketch looks real for me. Cel definetely FAN,

dro

MeganD. · Post by **MeganD.** » Sat Dec 16, 2006 10:26 pm

I don't know guys, there are a few things here that make me think twice about it being a fan cel.

The cel is numbered consistently with the sketch. While I know this is easy enough to "fake", it's darn gutsy. A deliberate and blatant attempt to pass a fan cel off as a production cel. I've seen quite a few Dragonball cels questioned as to their authenticity, but never one that included a sequence number. Most of the time if a seller is "caught" trying to pawn off a fan cel as a production cel, they feign ignorance saying whomever sold it to them told them it was an original then and tuck tail quickly. To include a false sequence number, well, it leaves little room to argue about the fan cel's intent, and like I said it's just extremely ballsy.

Another point that makes me question is the fact the cel is stapled to the bg, which Dragonball collectors know happens quite a bit. While I know this can be "faked" as well, it's a clever but unnessesary detail if done by a fan artist trying to pass off their work as authentic.

Aside from the fact it certainly looks like a Dragonball cel and is consistent with the series' style and character design, the color IS odd...I agree. His hair is too "golden" but then again, his ghi is off color as well. I'd say, if this is a production cel there is color adjustment going on and that the current background, being quite normal in coloring, is unmatching.

Anywho, it's an interesting cel, that's for sure. I have to say though, I fall on the side of production and not fan cel, but I'm not entirely convinced.

Heh. How's THAT for a safe opinion!

-Megan

DragonballZSubzero · Post by **DragonballZSubzero** » Sat Dec 16, 2006 10:47 pm

I agree Sandro, I noticed that too about the sketch looking authentic, or at least a lot more authentic than that cel.

I by no means am a DBZ cel expert but I do know the traditional ways they are suppose to look. I also that people know cels make good money and if they can fake them for something that cost them $5 to make and an hour or two to create they will.

Megan - I like those points that you stated, definitely noticing some stuff that most fan cels would lack. However, the most basic cel collectors know that cels have sequence numbers, so if you are going to try to pass off a cel for genuine, then they are going to put it there. Espically if the sketch, which looks pretty authentic, also has a sequence number. I didn't even notice they stapled the cel to the background, very nice catch

.

Now besides the fact, like I stated early, the colors are completely off. If you look at the other cels this guy is also selling the other two DBZ cels look crappy too. There is one of Majin Buu, that doesn't look that bad, but it is a very simple cel so it would not be hard to fake. But the Vegeta he has for sale looks just as bad as the Goku.

So, while I am 95% sure these are fakes, I am actually glad to see that other people disagree with that because we all have our opinions of what a DBZ could be. Though, either way, I think it is safe to say no one here, or probably anywhere, will be purchasing it.

MeganD. · Post by **MeganD.** » Sat Dec 16, 2006 11:08 pm

I by no means am a DBZ cel expert but I do know the traditional ways they are suppose to look. I also that people know cels make good money and if they can fake them for something that cost them $5 to make and an hour or two to create they will.

I completely agree it is entirely possible someone would fake the sequence number if there is a quick buck to be made. But in my experience, in the fan cel world, that would be something a lesser artist would attempt. (Someone more concerned with $$ than their skill) Whoever painted this cel, if it IS a fan cel, is good at capturing the essence of the character and the original style of the series. Basically, I wouldn't suspect someone of real skill at fan cel art to be so brazen.

The colors are NOT Drangonball, I totally agree. That might be explained by the context of the scene. I guess only a screencap would provide that answer. And the lines are odd...they look haggard and almost hand drawn. The lines in the Vegeta cel also appear less confident, I'm with you on that one as well. Poopy scanner perhaps? I really don't know. It definitely is odd.

I am actually glad to see that other people disagree with that because we all have our opinions of what a DBZ could be. Though, either way, I think it is safe to say no one here, or probably anywhere, will be purchasing it.

*L* Exactly! The reason I posted is because this one truly is puzzling and it's interesting to hear other people's view. And I can't speak for anyone else, but you can bet I certainly don't think the cel is worth that amount, fan cel or production.

Sugarflower · Post by **Sugarflower** » Sat Dec 16, 2006 11:25 pm

Out of all the cels in my collection (DBZ or non-DBZ) I've never come across one that had 3 staples at the top of the cel. All mine have had 2 staples only (some also had some tape for added security) or double sided tape only to hold he cel to the background, or two staples at the top and two staples at the bottom depending on the effects layers an such. Also, do the staples look like they are placed a bit to high on the cel/background? I've never paid much attention to them when removing them from my cels but always thought they were around the same area as the production holes.