Is this cel authentic?

MidniteKitten · Post by **MidniteKitten** » Sat Sep 13, 2008 1:06 pm

It looks very similar to the Neptune that popped up on eBay a while back. The fact that it has no sequence number makes me wary, also that the lines and colors seem to be the same as the last Neptune.

It does have a sketch which would make it seem more authentic, but I know that it's possible to make one especially since the sketch doesn't have a number as well and neither seem to have production holes as well.

Even if it turns out to be a fancel it looks pretty nice, if it stays low I might bid anyways...just curious to see what other people thought.

MidniteKitten · Post by **MidniteKitten** » Sat Sep 13, 2008 1:07 pm

Sorry, heres the link:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Sailor-Moon-Neptune ... dZViewItem

Goldknight · Post by **Goldknight** » Sat Sep 13, 2008 4:51 pm

Sailor Neptune anime cel with sketch! There does not appear to be a sequence number on either the cel or sketch, but it is authentic as it carries the typical Toei line fading.

So apparently line fading makes a cel authentic.

I would wary of calling it production because of the lack of holes and sequence number. Then again....I've seen plenty of cels/sketches trimmed at the studio. Either way I would bid as if it were a fancel to be on the safe side.

MidniteKitten · Post by **MidniteKitten** » Sat Sep 13, 2008 5:02 pm

If I do end up bidding I will bid as it were a fan cel. I think ill go thru a few episodes see if I can find the screenshot for comparison anyways. Thank you!

PS>If anyone does have a screencap I'd appreciate it.

RoboFlonne · Post by **RoboFlonne** » Sat Sep 13, 2008 5:16 pm

Without Production holes... I would pay less even if it's a real cel.

Hope you win, MidniteKitten!!!

Ganbatte!

MidniteKitten · Post by **MidniteKitten** » Sat Sep 13, 2008 5:22 pm

I'm not too picky about production holes per say, should I come across a cel that was authentic but no holes I'd probably still vie for it as I matte and display all my cels, so the holes aren't visible either way.

As far as the Neptune cel goes, I've decided I will bid on it but only in the last few hours if it maintains a decent price.

Belldandy16 · Post by **Belldandy16** » Sat Sep 13, 2008 9:32 pm

MidniteKitten wrote: As far as the Neptune cel goes, I've decided I will bid on it but only in the last few hours if it maintains a decent price.

either way (if its a fan cel or not) its a beautiful piece, nonetheless.
good luck! hope you get it (and at a great price too)!

klet · Post by **klet** » Sat Sep 13, 2008 10:06 pm

Actually, I'd say that line fade is a huge indication of an authetic cel, since fancels have hand-drawn lines, and they don't fade the way that copied lines do. Basically, production cels have their lines burned into them, which is why the brown stays behind when the black ink flakes away.

At the very least, lines that have faded to brown indicates that the lines were produced using the copy method. Very few fan cel artists have/had access to these machines.

The sketch looks like a production sketch as well. If the person painting the fancel actually makes a sketch, they usually don't use different colors to represent the color changes (shading) in the cel.

Of course, I don't know much about Sailor Moon, so I can't tell you if that's a significant scene or not. If it isn't, I can't imagine why someone would choose to make that paritcular cel. After all, it isn't the "perfect," head-on shot, or a character-revealing pose, or anything. What I'm saying is that while it is a lovely cel, it isn't the kind of shot/pose that usually becomes a fancel.

So, in my opinion, it's probably real.

Isn't the seller a member here? I could swear I've seen someone with some variation of chibiusa for a screen name post. Of course, I realize that's a character in SM, so it might not be the same person.

lcatino · Post by **lcatino** » Sat Sep 13, 2008 10:10 pm

MidniteKitten wrote:
Even if it turns out to be a fancel it looks pretty nice, if it stays low I might bid anyways...just curious to see what other people thought.

Wow, the cel is stunning! I don't know anything about SM, but it looks authentic.

Good luck on bidding!

pixie_princess · Post by **pixie_princess** » Sat Sep 13, 2008 10:34 pm

Without a larger picture I can't say anything for certain. There is the slight possibility that this started out life as a pan cel or oversized cel and it was trimmed down to be framed or something. If you're trying to match this, I suggest looking at the movies or maybe episodes where she is getting ready to use her submarine reflection attack with the mirror. Thats what this looks like. Probably narrow down into the SMS, SMSS movies, and Stars season -1st episode where they get attacked by Neherelia's mirror minions.

MidniteKitten · Post by **MidniteKitten** » Sun Sep 14, 2008 12:52 am

Thanks for all the advice, I've been sifting through and hope to find it soon!

As for the post on whether it's a significant scene or not, I would say so as technically it could be considered a bank cel seeing as it is one of her attacks, so it's slightly possible.

Seems like someone already bid, lets hope I can keep it low.

samiamew · Post by **samiamew** » Sun Sep 14, 2008 7:45 am

It originally was on YJ just a bit ago -- I can't remember if it stated 'fan cel' or not -- I don't think it went for much $$ -- but not sure.... I wish I could remember these things better

Wendy · Post by **Wendy** » Sun Sep 14, 2008 11:00 am

Well...for $1.25 you can't really go wrong either way.

Post by **sensei** » Sun Sep 14, 2008 11:16 am

Strikes me that the seller is being more than honest in noting that the cel is also dinged on the face of the character, something that isn't apparent from the scan. Not being a SM collector, I can't say, but it certainly doesn't strike me as being an obvious fan cel. It could be a color test, like my AMG Belldandy OAV cel, which has no sequence number but an authentic-looking case of line fading.

kodoku_na_tabi · Post by **kodoku_na_tabi** » Sun Sep 14, 2008 11:58 am

I am confident the cel is genuine. Here is its history.

It previously sold on eBay here: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0266863816

That seller bought it on YJ in July: http://page5.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/e82979813

Here are the pics that were posted:

The listing also notes that the cel is trimmed. It happens that both buyer and seller are the same as for the Neptune fan cel I posted about previously (http://www.anime-beta.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=24487).

That seller (taka121824) bought the cel in another YJ auction in June of last year from minami_angel2000, a well known cel dealer. The cel was not trimmed at the time. Here are those pics:

Neither YJ listing had any indication of this being a fan cel. I have seen taka121824 auction off several trimmed cels that had been purchased intact, so I think the owner just routinely trimmed their cels (probably to fit in a display book). When taka121824 sold the fan cel, they clearly identified it as such.

The shot is from the Submarine Reflection sequence in the SuperS movie. It would be the B12. It is not a bank cel since this particular sequence appears only once.

On a different topic...

I matte and display all my cels

Based on deeply regrettable personal experience, I strongly recommend against framing cels. Sailor Moon cels in particular are extremely susceptible to line fading. If exposed to light, even low light and under UV-resistant glass, it's not a question of whether they will fade but how soon. It may take several months or several years, but since the fading is gradual you're not likely to notice until the damage is severe.

Basically, production cels have their lines burned into them, which is why the brown stays behind when the black ink flakes away.

I have found this not to be the case. Line fading in Sailor Moon cels is usually seen through the front of the acetate sheet where the line itself on the back is completely painted over, so it's not possible for it to flake away. It's just light that causes the copy toner to fade and discolor, and contact with paint of certain colors promotes the process. You'll see the worst fading in flesh-tone, red, tan, and other light-colored areas. It's typical for lines bordered only on one side with flesh tone and on the other with green or blue to be better preserved that those with flesh-tone on both sides. The best preserved lines are those with least contact with paint, such as on separate mouth layers and harmony cels (no paint).

Keeping the cels in the dark is the only way to prevent the damage from progressing. I certainly understand the appeal of having cels on display in one's home, so I think making color copies and framing those is a great alternative. Even though it's not quite the same, the peace of mind in knowing your cels are safe in proper storage is well worth it.

Anime-Beta TNG

Is this cel authentic?

Is this cel authentic?

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